Comments on: Investigating in the Middle East http://sirenschronicles.com/2008/08/09/investigating-in-the-middle-east/ "To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public."-Teddy Roosevelt Fri, 19 Mar 2010 17:19:58 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: CarolGee http://sirenschronicles.com/2008/08/09/investigating-in-the-middle-east/comment-page-1/#comment-7265 CarolGee Tue, 12 Aug 2008 21:55:50 +0000 http://sirenschronicles.com/?p=3330#comment-7265 Fran, if you and Dusty, and others all over the blogosphere, are any measure -- and I suspect you are part of a majority by now -- a bunch of rascals could get thrown out in November. I am with you regarding the deepest part of the tragedy, the loss of military and civilian lives in the Iraq war can just never be condoned. Enormous damage has been done to our country, but I still have faith in its basic resilience. And it will take some time. Fran, if you and Dusty, and others all over the blogosphere, are any measure — and I suspect you are part of a majority by now — a bunch of rascals could get thrown out in November.
I am with you regarding the deepest part of the tragedy, the loss of military and civilian lives in the Iraq war can just never be condoned.
Enormous damage has been done to our country, but I still have faith in its basic resilience. And it will take some time.

]]> By: fran http://sirenschronicles.com/2008/08/09/investigating-in-the-middle-east/comment-page-1/#comment-7262 fran Tue, 12 Aug 2008 17:45:16 +0000 http://sirenschronicles.com/?p=3330#comment-7262 I have no Pollyanna love affair with my State so-called representatives. there are people who say we have a democrat seated so that HAS to be good. Well, maybe in theory, but these politicians have done nothing BUT disappoint.... especially on the big issues like the war. the first six years of the Bush admin, they whined that their hands were tied, that they were a minority..... but they never attemptd to use the power of the purse, because they feared or used the excuse of the need to *support the troops*, as a reason to keep funding the war. Support the troops by funding the war, which is killing & injuring more troops. the became limp noodles on the matter of Impeachment, and when in 2006, they were finally give majority status & we all became so very hopeful they could actually do something-- about impeachment & stop funding the war (or illegal occupation), they did not. They continued to wield the rubber stamp-- and in the end, they might bicker or make a fuss about something, but always caved to Bush. They have the majoritthey have the votes to override the vetos, yet they do not. the war matter is not just political opinion-- people are dying & suffering, and we have nothing but more of the same. The fact you have to look to other states to name a few good politicians is a statement in & of itself. I'm not on your case personally, but it is a statement to have to search the entire country of alleged representatives, to name less thana handful of politicians that actually are considered good. Even in our state.... the re we have has been a pushover for war funding was running against an even shittier candidate. So our choices were shit & shittier. Am I thrilled that the less shitty candidate represents us? Not exactly. How many people are dying because of their inability to truly represent? When I say it is a bloody mess, sadly, I mean it quite literally & figuratively. frans last blog post..<a href="http://ramblings-fran.blogspot.com/2008/08/forever-young.html" rel="nofollow">Forever Young</a> I have no Pollyanna love affair with my State so-called representatives. there are people who say we have a democrat seated so that HAS to be good. Well, maybe in theory, but these politicians have done nothing BUT disappoint…. especially on the big issues like the war.
the first six years of the Bush admin, they whined that their hands were tied, that they were a minority….. but they never attemptd to use the power of the purse, because they feared or used the excuse of the need to *support the troops*, as a reason to keep funding the war.
Support the troops by funding the war, which is killing & injuring more troops.
the became limp noodles on the matter of Impeachment, and when in 2006, they were finally give majority status & we all became so very hopeful they could actually do something– about impeachment & stop funding the war (or illegal occupation), they did not.
They continued to wield the rubber stamp– and in the end, they might bicker or make a fuss about something, but always caved to Bush. They have the majoritthey have the votes to override the vetos, yet they do not.
the war matter is not just political opinion– people are dying & suffering, and we have nothing but more of the same.

The fact you have to look to other states to name a few good politicians is a statement in & of itself.
I’m not on your case personally, but it is a statement to have to search the entire country of alleged representatives, to name less thana handful of politicians that actually are considered good.

Even in our state…. the re we have has been a pushover for war funding was running against an even shittier candidate.
So our choices were shit & shittier.

Am I thrilled that the less shitty candidate represents us?

Not exactly.

How many people are dying because of their inability to truly represent?

When I say it is a bloody mess, sadly, I mean it quite literally & figuratively.

frans last blog post..Forever Young

]]> By: Dusty http://sirenschronicles.com/2008/08/09/investigating-in-the-middle-east/comment-page-1/#comment-7251 Dusty Tue, 12 Aug 2008 01:39:38 +0000 http://sirenschronicles.com/?p=3330#comment-7251 Hi Carol! I live in the reddest county in CA. We are represented by R's here. Locally the biblethumpers rule the roost. I have come from the Vietnam Era..organizing was harder than it is now. I worked for a while for MoveOn here as an organizer. It was hard but there are people in this red county that were willing to take part in the process. What bothered me about MoveOn is that all the money they collect is kept by them. They do NOT support the anti-war movement or any other organization that is working to change things. They do NOT support any groups, but they do throw money at candidates and of course their 527 arm. Whitehouse is a good guy, and Snow isn't bad either..I just named the two I respect the most off the top of my head...hell, even Arlen Specter isn't bad on constitutional rights and issues. Some dayz I am way too negative, and if I take the time to expound on my thoughts, they come off a little better than just short negative answers. Thank you for your wonderful articles and for allowing us to publish them here at Sirens. ;) Hi Carol!

I live in the reddest county in CA. We are represented by R’s here. Locally the biblethumpers rule the roost.

I have come from the Vietnam Era..organizing was harder than it is now.

I worked for a while for MoveOn here as an organizer. It was hard but there are people in this red county that were willing to take part in the process.

What bothered me about MoveOn is that all the money they collect is kept by them. They do NOT support the anti-war movement or any other organization that is working to change things. They do NOT support any groups, but they do throw money at candidates and of course their 527 arm.

Whitehouse is a good guy, and Snow isn’t bad either..I just named the two I respect the most off the top of my head…hell, even Arlen Specter isn’t bad on constitutional rights and issues.

Some dayz I am way too negative, and if I take the time to expound on my thoughts, they come off a little better than just short negative answers.

Thank you for your wonderful articles and for allowing us to publish them here at Sirens. ;)

]]> By: CarolGee http://sirenschronicles.com/2008/08/09/investigating-in-the-middle-east/comment-page-1/#comment-7250 CarolGee Mon, 11 Aug 2008 21:16:31 +0000 http://sirenschronicles.com/?p=3330#comment-7250 Dusty, I have a feeling that you are not being well-represented by your House Member or Senators, and that you can't find any local candidate to support and work for. All three of mine are Republicans and walk the party line. However, there are a few from elsewhere around the country that I admire, such as Senator Sheldon Whitehouse, and even in small ways, Maine's republican Senators Snowe and Collins. One other factor that is ruining governance is special interest money and the lobbyists. So there's lots wrong. I have to admit that I was trained for community work by the League of Women Voters in the early 1970's, so that gave me a bias generally in favor of elected officials. And I also admit that my other name used occasionally among some in the blogosphere is "Pollyanna-Merry-Sunshine." So take me with a grain of salt. Thanks for your comment, Dusty, and for being such a good editor here. Dusty, I have a feeling that you are not being well-represented by your House Member or Senators, and that you can’t find any local candidate to support and work for. All three of mine are Republicans and walk the party line.
However, there are a few from elsewhere around the country that I admire, such as Senator Sheldon Whitehouse, and even in small ways, Maine’s republican Senators Snowe and Collins. One other factor that is ruining governance is special interest money and the lobbyists. So there’s lots wrong.
I have to admit that I was trained for community work by the League of Women Voters in the early 1970’s, so that gave me a bias generally in favor of elected officials. And I also admit that my other name used occasionally among some in the blogosphere is “Pollyanna-Merry-Sunshine.” So take me with a grain of salt.
Thanks for your comment, Dusty, and for being such a good editor here.

]]> By: Dusty http://sirenschronicles.com/2008/08/09/investigating-in-the-middle-east/comment-page-1/#comment-7246 Dusty Mon, 11 Aug 2008 16:39:46 +0000 http://sirenschronicles.com/?p=3330#comment-7246 All politicians are scum. We have a few elected reps that are not hardcore pols-Kucinich, Feingold to name two. Obama is a pol...sad but true. As for better than McCain, only time will tell. Billy Clinton was a jerk and worthless in my opinion..best democratic president the republicans ever had. ;) All politicians are scum. We have a few elected reps that are not hardcore pols-Kucinich, Feingold to name two.

Obama is a pol…sad but true. As for better than McCain, only time will tell. Billy Clinton was a jerk and worthless in my opinion..best democratic president the republicans ever had. ;)

]]> By: CarolGee http://sirenschronicles.com/2008/08/09/investigating-in-the-middle-east/comment-page-1/#comment-7239 CarolGee Mon, 11 Aug 2008 10:15:55 +0000 http://sirenschronicles.com/?p=3330#comment-7239 I remember, Fran, what my PoliSci prof said about "politics." He called it the "art of the possible." My thinking is this on voting. If it would be possible to cast a vote for either 1)McCain or 2)Obama, or 3)not vote at all, I'll take box number two, and urge everyone else to do the same. It is entirely possible that either of the other choices would be as good, but not likely. I have no illusions about what comes next. I think the deal should be one pragmatic decision at a time, and stay "grounded in the day." Thanks, Fran, I enjoy our dialogue. CarolGees last blog post..<a href="http://carol-sandy1.blogspot.com/2008/08/off-beaten-path-of-politics.html" rel="nofollow">Off the beaten path of politics</a> I remember, Fran, what my PoliSci prof said about “politics.” He called it the “art of the possible.”
My thinking is this on voting. If it would be possible to cast a vote for either 1)McCain or 2)Obama, or 3)not vote at all, I’ll take box number two, and urge everyone else to do the same. It is entirely possible that either of the other choices would be as good, but not likely.
I have no illusions about what comes next. I think the deal should be one pragmatic decision at a time, and stay “grounded in the day.”
Thanks, Fran, I enjoy our dialogue.

CarolGees last blog post..Off the beaten path of politics

]]> By: fran http://sirenschronicles.com/2008/08/09/investigating-in-the-middle-east/comment-page-1/#comment-7238 fran Mon, 11 Aug 2008 02:32:40 +0000 http://sirenschronicles.com/?p=3330#comment-7238 I agree Carol--- Obama is undoubtably better, but the cynic in me says politicians are politicians.... our system makes them corrupt, and most will say whatever you want to hear to get elected. frans last blog post..<a href="http://ramblings-fran.blogspot.com/2008/08/insurance-quandry.html" rel="nofollow">Insurance Quandry</a> I agree Carol— Obama is undoubtably better, but the cynic in me says politicians are politicians…. our system makes them corrupt, and most will say whatever you want to hear to get elected.

frans last blog post..Insurance Quandry

]]> By: CarolGee http://sirenschronicles.com/2008/08/09/investigating-in-the-middle-east/comment-page-1/#comment-7234 CarolGee Sun, 10 Aug 2008 11:01:55 +0000 http://sirenschronicles.com/?p=3330#comment-7234 Fran, your comment is thoughtful and welcome. The war clamp-down seems complete. Except for those few independents who go out to get their stories with either hired protection or no protection, it is darned hard to find out the truth. For sure we cannot confine our reading to American news providers. One of my resources for years has been Aljazeera, who provided pretty good stuff, it seems to me. The other good source, I think the best, is London's Financial Times. For perspective, I also read Russia's Ria Novosti (gov't influenced, of course) and the Asia Times. Regarding Obama, with all his flaws he's still worlds better than MCCain, IMHO. CarolGees last blog post..<a href="http://carol-sandy1.blogspot.com/2008/08/other-nations-today-battles-unfold.html" rel="nofollow">Other Nations Today -- the battles unfold</a> Fran, your comment is thoughtful and welcome. The war clamp-down seems complete. Except for those few independents who go out to get their stories with either hired protection or no protection, it is darned hard to find out the truth.
For sure we cannot confine our reading to American news providers. One of my resources for years has been Aljazeera, who provided pretty good stuff, it seems to me. The other good source, I think the best, is London’s Financial Times. For perspective, I also read Russia’s Ria Novosti (gov’t influenced, of course) and the Asia Times.
Regarding Obama, with all his flaws he’s still worlds better than MCCain, IMHO.

CarolGees last blog post..Other Nations Today — the battles unfold

]]> By: Fran http://sirenschronicles.com/2008/08/09/investigating-in-the-middle-east/comment-page-1/#comment-7231 Fran Sun, 10 Aug 2008 00:26:32 +0000 http://sirenschronicles.com/?p=3330#comment-7231 I never liked the embedded press idea-- press that was controlled by the military, editied by the military. How can you get the truth out under that kind of scrutiny. If you publish things they disapprove of, they kick you out, as one journalist recently discovered when he wrote a blog oiece about something & the US military deemed he put the troops at risk by showing a killed soldier (unrecognizable). It bothers me that Obama is talking about sending 10,000 more troops to Afghanistan.... and it also bothers me that he would be so naieve to announce this 6 months in advance. I don't want troop escalation in Afghanistan, but giving the Taliban a 6 months heads up is probably not so wise either. Frans last blog post..<a href="http://ramblings-fran.blogspot.com/2008/08/reality-check.html" rel="nofollow">Reality Check</a> I never liked the embedded press idea– press that was controlled by the military, editied by the military. How can you get the truth out under that kind of scrutiny. If you publish things they disapprove of, they kick you out, as one journalist recently discovered when he wrote a blog oiece about something & the US military deemed he put the troops at risk by showing a killed soldier (unrecognizable).

It bothers me that Obama is talking about sending 10,000 more troops to Afghanistan…. and it also bothers me that he would be so naieve to announce this 6 months in advance.

I don’t want troop escalation in Afghanistan, but giving the Taliban a 6 months heads up is probably not so wise either.

Frans last blog post..Reality Check

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